“What questions are you going to ask me?”
“No questions. We will not treat this as an interview. You just relax and relate what happened, like a story-telling session, and then I will video-record everything you say.”
“What exactly do you need me to say?”
“I suppose you can just relate how you first met Saiful, how he came to be employed by Parti Keadilan Rakyat, what he did in the office, and anything else you know about his allegation that Anwar sodomised him. The best thing is for you to relax and speak naturally, like you are telling a story, no questions and answers session which will make you stiff and not look natural.”
“Okay, if I make any mistake you will edit the tape?”
“No, we will not edit anything. That will tantamount to tampering with the evidence. Never mind if you make a mistake. Just repeat what you said or start over again. This video recording is not for broadcasting. This is for internal use only. We shall keep the recording in a safe place in case the police arrest you and force you to make a statement against your will. Then, if the police charge you for anything, we will be reveal this tape to prove that what you told the police under duress is different from what you said tonight. That is why you must speak naturally and not look stiff or like you are being forced to say whatever you are going to saying. This video recording is for your protection to ensure that they will not arrest you and force you to make any statement that is not true.”
“Okay.”
“Let me know when you are ready. Drink some water to clear your throat and finish your cigarette first. Then we will start. Be comfortable and don’t worry. No need to even look at the camera if that makes you uncomfortable. Speak to me. Look at me and talk. It is easier when you speak to a person than to the camera.”
Sessions starts and he relates his story. After 15 minutes he gestures for the camera to be switched off and I oblige.
“I am not sure whether I want this next part recorded on camera.”
“Never mind. We can record it anyway and then if you feel it is damaging it need never surface.”
“I would rather get my lawyer’s advice first before this second part is recorded because it implicates Najib in the sodomy allegation against Anwar.”
“Okay, we can leave the camera off and you can relate the second part off-camera. Then we decide later if it should be recorded or not.”
“This second part is about our meeting with Najib.”
“Oh, you also went to see Najib?”
“Actually, I did not know why we were going to see Najib. Saiful just said that he wanted to go and see Najib and he wanted me to follow him. So I followed him. I was present when Saiful discussed with Najib about the sodomy allegation against Anwar. I did not know he was going to see Najib about that.”
“You did not know he was going to see Najib about the sodomy allegation?”
“No, he did not tell me.”
“Was it staged?”
“Staged?”
“Yes, did Najib already know what Saiful was seeing him about or did Najib not know beforehand?”
“I don’t know.”
“Did Najib appear shocked or surprised or did he look like he already knew what they were going to talk about?”
“Najib looked very natural.”
“So Najib did not look shocked or surprised?”
“No.”
“So, from Najib’s reaction, he appeared like he already knew what they were going to discuss. Only you did not know. What about the other people in the room?”
“They also did not look surprised.”
“So it appeared like everyone in the room, except you, already knew what Saiful was going to talk to Najib about.”
“Maybe.”
“But why go to Najib to talk about this? Why not go to the police or the religious department?”
“I don’t know.”
“Did Najib offer any advice?”
“No.”
“Did Najib ask Saiful to make a police report?”
“No, he just listened.”
“Did Najib ask Saiful: ‘why come to me to complain? What has Anwar sodomising you got to do with the Deputy Prime Minister of Malaysia’?”
“No.”
“Do you think that maybe all this was a show just for your benefit? The fact that everyone appeared to already know what the discussion was all about, except you, appears like they wanted you, an ‘outsider’, to hear the discussion.”
“I am not sure.”
“Before the visit to Najib’s office, has Saiful ever told you or anyone else in the office that Anwar sodomised him?”
“No.”
“So the first time you heard of this was when Saiful brought you to meet Najib.”
“Yes.”
“Did Saiful discuss anything else with Najib like a scholarship or something like that?”
“No.”
“They just discussed the sodomy matter?”
“Yes.”
“Why not I video-record this part?”
“Let me discuss it with the lawyer first. If the lawyer says it is okay then we can record it tomorrow.”
“Okay, I will not force you. I don’t want you to tell anyone later that you were reluctant to let me video-record this part but I forced you to do so against your will. You speak to your lawyer first and then we can meet again tomorrow and record this part of your statement.”
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